Water conditioners...how to long to wait

[johnpeezy]

Okay so i now have a variety of water conditioners start right, aqua safe prime

All the directions on the bottle are pretty straight forward on in regards to measurements but none of them give me any type of approximate time its need to take effect. Is this stuff instant, does it clear the ammonia as soon as I treat the water with it?

and i rememeber from a long time ago when i watched my brother doing is tanks he used to fill the canister of his filter with like lava rocks or something ( i think it was because of bacteria) should i do this as well?

Thanks for all the help so far and i have like a million questions this is only the tip of the iceberg, I have been researching day and night for about 2 weeks straight now and the only thing i really accomplish is creating more questions for myself to find an answer too.

[DaisyTattoo]

Water conditioners work instantly. Many of us use a product called a Python to do waterchanges by directly putting the water in the tank from the tap... I add conditioner when I start the water into the tank, while the fish are still in it...and have never had a problem. There does need to be some kind of filter media in the cannister, but I really don't know much about cannisters so I will allow someone else to answer that question.

[DaisyTattoo]

Ooops...didn't read the whole post... Don't use water conditioners to clear up ammonia. They are mainly for taking Chlorine and Chloramines out of your water. If you are wanting to cycle a new tank, please read this article. It will answer all your questions...

Cycling a tank (FW) - AquariumBoard Forums

[johnpeezy]

Oh man i messed up on my post, i wasn't asking about the ammonia in the tank what i meant to ask about the the chlorine and chloaramine your frist post was exactly what i was looking for thanks a bunch.

[DaisyTattoo]

No problem! I read what you meant the first time, then looked back and saw ammonia. I know some people think that bc some water conditioners bind ammonia, that it makes it safe in the tank. Just wanted to clarify. Glad to help!

[johnpeezy]

OKay now im going to try and add some detail to my second question as well

I have an aqua tech powerfilter, one of those filters that hang on the back of the tank.

It has two seperate cartrages in it, A bio fiber (never get replaced for bacteria culture) adn another filter (i assume its the carbon filter, this is the one the manufacturer says to replace more frequently then alot of people reccomed me to do)

On the back of the filter there is filter box that keeps the two filters fully submersed in water while the filter is on, This is what my brother used to add some sort of rock into (im unsure if it was coral, lavarock, etc) I'm assuming is was so a bacteria culture could be established there as well.

A few concerns i have in regars to doing this is my water pH and the hardness/softness of my tank water. I have read a few articles on the inter net about adding certain "substances" to the tank will changes the water chemistry.

An (possibly inaccurate) example of what im talking about is adding chorle to my tank could chang the water pH

all i wants is another place bacteris can establish but I'm afraid of messing up my tank in the process.

has anyone ever done this to there tanks?

[DaisyTattoo]

This sounds like and HOB filter(Hang on back) A Cannister filter is more bucket shaped and normallly stays under the tank. I only keep the filter cartridges in my HOB filters, but when I do a water change, I swish them around in water I have removed from the tank and return them to the filter. I rarely ever replace mine and if I do, I only replace one of the 2 in the filter. Hope this helps.

Also...the bacteria doesn't only live in the filter, it also lives in the substrate of your tank. Many people report a "mini cycle" after replacing all the substrate.

[johnpeezy]

oh ok, well unfortunatley foe me i may have to replace my substrate but i have to wait for tank establishment. At the moment i have gravel in the tanks its looks nice but thats about all i think i may want sand for it in the future. I'll keep this in mind when the time comes.

[joephys]

In a nut shell the bacteria covert toxic ammonia to nitrate. A lot of people will use porous rock because it has more surface area for bacteria to colonize. Crushed coral is common because it slowly dissolves in the water and increases the hardness.

Lava rock is inert, so it won't effect the water at all. Its fine in a filter, but I would keep it out of the tank because it has sharp edges that can damage fishes mouths with they nip at things on the rock, or brush against it. Things are often added to the filter because that is where there is the greatest amount of water movement.

That being said, it isn't necessary to add anything. Bacteria will grow on any surface. In my opinion, the glass, gravel and any decorations should provide enough surface area to cycle an aquarium. If you need extra media, there are too many fish or they are being over fed.

The carbon, it can be changed out, but you would find that most people who have been keeping fish a while simply do with out it. Regular water changes are cheaper and better than carbon. Carbon does however make a good thing for bacteria to grow on because its so porous, in which case, its best to never change it.

[johnpeezy]

Sweet exactly what i was looking for thanks. The reason why I was searching for a mean of extra media:

I'm planning on starting up another tank in a few months or so. I was planning on attempting to create a means of "romovable bacteria culture that i could switch from the cycled tank to the new tank. Now this is probably a dumb question but thats what the newbie forums are for right?

I have a 14 gallon tank now, would a bacteria culture from this existing tank even make a dent in say a 50 gallon tank on start up?

-AND-

could i use a bacteris culture from an existing tank in a fishless cycle or would the ammonia levels just kill it off?

[joephys]

Thats why the forum is here, and nope its not a dumb question at all.

What you want to do is commonly called insta-cycling, and is a great way to get a new tank going with out the wait of cycling. Still need to have a little patients and use a little caution however.

The bacteria grow to levels necessary to consume the amount of ammonia being produced, not to the size of the tank (unless there is physically not enough room because so much is being produced). So basically, using a culture from the 14 gallon is perfectly fine as long as you do it right. If you can get a large culture, then you should be able to add fish right away.

What I would do if I knew I was setting up a new tank, I would get the filter a month ahead of time and let it run on your current tank for a month. If there is too much water movement, just turn the flow rate down. After a month, just move the filter for the new tank over to the new tank, and add one or two fish. Watch for mini cycles for 3-5 days. If you have one, it shouldn't take long for the bacteria to catch up. Then just keep adding 1-3 fish at a time watching for mini cycles until, your stocking is what you want.

[johnpeezy]

ahh good idea with new filter and all